@michaelrose55 said:
I made the mistake to take the old E175 out of the box. After one run around the layout it's clear that there has to be catenary. I can't have a layout without this beauty!
Michael:
Exactly my feelings. It is an E 75 or 175 though. E 75 is the old number, 175 the computer number introduced in 1968. Out of some reason Trix produced the loco with the new number. Marklin's old E 52 came as 152.
I love (old) German electrics. I do not have all, but have collected a good portion of them over the years:
Trix: E 05, E 70, E 75
Roco: E 16, E 17, E 18, E 44, E 44.5, E 69, E 71, E 91, E 94, Et 85
Brawa: E 95
Liliput: Et 11
Unfortunately, the new ones are almost as tempting:
Lima: 110 004
Liliput: 110 001
Roco: 103, 110.1, 110.3, 112, 140, 150, 151, 181
Fleischmann: 120, 141
and then there are the five Austrian and Swiss ones. It is like an addiction: Trains, coffee and chocolate will be my undoing.
I haven't had any trouble with what little catenary I have on my layout, but I was warned that catenary is the last item to be installed after ballasting and scenery is completed.
I run the pans on my locomotives slightly below the wire. I tie them down with a strand of wire from a 22 ga piece of wire. Barely noticeable. They would run fine on the wire and they have, but since it is incomplete, starting under the wire would be devastating for pans in the full upright position.
I run the locos with the pantos at the wire. I installed the catenary after finishing ballasting, but before scenery construction. If you at all think about running Swiss locos, you need to install the catenary with a smaller zig-zack, Swiss pantos are narrower than German ones. Tested all my catenary with my BLS Ae 4/4.
I had some health issues and other things to take care of but as of today I'm starting to work on the layout again. I still have trouble making decent German style structures so for now I'm doing something else: work a bit on the landscape.
As a first step I cleaned this peninsula and removed all dirt and clutter. It's amazing how every horizontal surface fills up with stuff over time!
I haven't had much interest in the layout the last few weeks but today the model railroad virus bit me and made me install a block detection unit for the branch line. Now I have to wire it up...
It's very simple. The module has 16 current sensors for 16 blocks and a serial interface to transport the information to the controller. If I ever get to the point where I want my trains to run on automatic I would have to connect a PC and use a software package like Train Controller. Right now all I'm doing is creating the necessary infrastructure.
@michaelrose55 said:
It's very simple. The module has 16 current sensors for 16 blocks and a serial interface to transport the information to the controller. If I ever get to the point where I want my trains to run on automatic I would have to connect a PC and use a software package like Train Controller. Right now all I'm doing is creating the necessary infrastructure.
Michael E,
If I may, I can elaborate a little on what Michael R said about detectors.
Current-based (or "sniffer") detectors -- there are several other types of detectors that could be used on a layout, but, which are now mostly falling out of favor -- sit between the power source (main control station or booster) and the track. In other words, the power to the track is routed through the detector.
The detector monitors the electric current being consumed -- and, if there is a power-consuming piece of rolling stock (locomotive or even passenger car with interior lighting), the detector notices that and does something. The reason I say "does something" is that different detectors can do different things. They can send a new digital signal over a bus to the main control station (or a computer connected to it), or they can simply turn a circuit on or off.
For detectors to work, you need to feed power individually to track segments called blocks -- and these need to be electrical insulated from each other. If you plan to use detectors, you need to plan these blocks prior to track installation, as adding electrical gaps (insulated joiners) and additional track feeders after the tracks have been laid and have scenery over them (tunnels) is obviously more troublesome than doing so during track installation.
Depending on the design of the detector, you may need one or two additional power feeds, in addition to the track power circuit.
one to power the internal electronics
one for the circuit(s) that are to be turned on or off as tracks are occupied or not occupied.
While having these additional power feeds requires more wiring, it also keeps the detector from consuming a substantial amount of the power that would normally be going to the tracks.
For detectors that send out digital signals indicating that a particular block is occupied, the detector needs to be programmed with a numeric address for each block.
Wiring blocks for detection negates the idea that digital operation requires less wiring for the layout. Of course, the detectors provide a lot more functionality.
Detectors that simply turn a circuit on or off for each block can also be used input into other devices that then send digital signals about block occupancy. (Again, the latter unit would have to be programmed with identifications for each block.)
While model railroaders often think of detectors being used in support of (somewhat) prototypical signal systems or computer-supported automated or semi-automated operation, a very basic use is simply to show the occupancy of hidden tracks. For this you can use detectors like the Viessmann 5206. This detector simply turns circuits on or off, based on the status of the related block.
I am using these to feed LEDs on a panel representing hidden trackage, including the three-tier helix. As pointed out above, this application requires two additional power sources (in addition to the track power) -- AC for the detector electronics; DC to power the display LEDs.
The Roco books Digital for Beginners (particularly volumes 2 and 3) heavily focus on the use of detectors.
Michael, I posted your layouts in a few Model Train Groups and the guys are blown away. I hope you keep on building, the layout is coming along so nice. I think it could be one of the best European model train layouts in the USA. A few months ago we were commissioned to build a massive Marklin layout for a wealthy customer. The layout will be massive completely computer-controlled. The layout will be remarkable, we just started on the benchwork. We will be posting progress soon.
@reynauld1963 said:
Michael, I posted your layouts in a few Model Train Groups and the guys are blown away. I hope you keep on building, the layout is coming along so nice. I think it could be one of the best European model train layouts in the USA.
Rey, thanks a lot. It's nice that you like the layout, because I don't so much. I have a lot of trouble still with the German theme and with the catenary as well. If the layout survives it will be without catenary and I will be limited to steam and diesel. Because of all this I'm not making any progress and that does not make me happy.
I've had no interest in the layout for a month but today I started working again. I installed another occupancy detector module and started wiring it up.
I spent 2 hours this morning with sculptamold and rock castings trying to make this thing look like something other than a mole hill but it just doesn't work. I'm not sure what I will do now.
@michaelrose55 said:
I spent 2 hours this morning with sculptamold and rock castings trying to make this thing look like something other than a mole hill but it just doesn't work. I'm not sure what I will do now.
How about lots of trees, interspersed with a few rocks? That would make for some credible foothills to larger mountains. I assume you still have trees left over from previous projects.
I decided to do what Ernest suggested. I do not model mountains, but the foothills of them. My motivatng areas for modelling are the Lahn valley and particularly the Eifel region in Germany. The mountains are lower and more rounded in these regions because they are much older than new ones like the Alps.
Comments
Michael:
Exactly my feelings. It is an E 75 or 175 though. E 75 is the old number, 175 the computer number introduced in 1968. Out of some reason Trix produced the loco with the new number. Marklin's old E 52 came as 152.
Ulrich
Ulrich,
Thanks for pointing that out to me. It's still a beautiful engine!
I've added the visible layer to the building and painted everything:
Michael:
I love (old) German electrics. I do not have all, but have collected a good portion of them over the years:
Trix: E 05, E 70, E 75
Roco: E 16, E 17, E 18, E 44, E 44.5, E 69, E 71, E 91, E 94, Et 85
Brawa: E 95
Liliput: Et 11
Unfortunately, the new ones are almost as tempting:
Lima: 110 004
Liliput: 110 001
Roco: 103, 110.1, 110.3, 112, 140, 150, 151, 181
Fleischmann: 120, 141
and then there are the five Austrian and Swiss ones. It is like an addiction: Trains, coffee and chocolate will be my undoing.
Ulrich
I haven't had any trouble with what little catenary I have on my layout, but I was warned that catenary is the last item to be installed after ballasting and scenery is completed.
I run the pans on my locomotives slightly below the wire. I tie them down with a strand of wire from a 22 ga piece of wire. Barely noticeable. They would run fine on the wire and they have, but since it is incomplete, starting under the wire would be devastating for pans in the full upright position.
I run the locos with the pantos at the wire. I installed the catenary after finishing ballasting, but before scenery construction. If you at all think about running Swiss locos, you need to install the catenary with a smaller zig-zack, Swiss pantos are narrower than German ones. Tested all my catenary with my BLS Ae 4/4.
Ulrich
I had some health issues and other things to take care of but as of today I'm starting to work on the layout again. I still have trouble making decent German style structures so for now I'm doing something else: work a bit on the landscape.
As a first step I cleaned this peninsula and removed all dirt and clutter. It's amazing how every horizontal surface fills up with stuff over time!
The roads go in first:
Michael:
Hope you feeling better. Glad you start working on the landscape.
Ulrich
I haven't had much interest in the layout the last few weeks but today the model railroad virus bit me and made me install a block detection unit for the branch line. Now I have to wire it up...
Could you explain how that is wired and theory of operation?
I would like to have something like that on my layout but I'm not convinced it's needed for the small size of my layout.
It's very simple. The module has 16 current sensors for 16 blocks and a serial interface to transport the information to the controller. If I ever get to the point where I want my trains to run on automatic I would have to connect a PC and use a software package like Train Controller. Right now all I'm doing is creating the necessary infrastructure.
I now do remember why I never really wired up a layout... it's a pain!
Michael wrote: "the model railroad virus bit me "
Better that one when the other....
Michael E,
If I may, I can elaborate a little on what Michael R said about detectors.
Current-based (or "sniffer") detectors -- there are several other types of detectors that could be used on a layout, but, which are now mostly falling out of favor -- sit between the power source (main control station or booster) and the track. In other words, the power to the track is routed through the detector.
The detector monitors the electric current being consumed -- and, if there is a power-consuming piece of rolling stock (locomotive or even passenger car with interior lighting), the detector notices that and does something. The reason I say "does something" is that different detectors can do different things. They can send a new digital signal over a bus to the main control station (or a computer connected to it), or they can simply turn a circuit on or off.
For detectors to work, you need to feed power individually to track segments called blocks -- and these need to be electrical insulated from each other. If you plan to use detectors, you need to plan these blocks prior to track installation, as adding electrical gaps (insulated joiners) and additional track feeders after the tracks have been laid and have scenery over them (tunnels) is obviously more troublesome than doing so during track installation.
Depending on the design of the detector, you may need one or two additional power feeds, in addition to the track power circuit.
While having these additional power feeds requires more wiring, it also keeps the detector from consuming a substantial amount of the power that would normally be going to the tracks.
For detectors that send out digital signals indicating that a particular block is occupied, the detector needs to be programmed with a numeric address for each block.
Wiring blocks for detection negates the idea that digital operation requires less wiring for the layout. Of course, the detectors provide a lot more functionality.
Detectors that simply turn a circuit on or off for each block can also be used input into other devices that then send digital signals about block occupancy. (Again, the latter unit would have to be programmed with identifications for each block.)
While model railroaders often think of detectors being used in support of (somewhat) prototypical signal systems or computer-supported automated or semi-automated operation, a very basic use is simply to show the occupancy of hidden tracks. For this you can use detectors like the Viessmann 5206. This detector simply turns circuits on or off, based on the status of the related block.
I am using these to feed LEDs on a panel representing hidden trackage, including the three-tier helix. As pointed out above, this application requires two additional power sources (in addition to the track power) -- AC for the detector electronics; DC to power the display LEDs.
The Roco books Digital for Beginners (particularly volumes 2 and 3) heavily focus on the use of detectors.
Hope that helps.
-- Ernest
It certainly did. Thank you for the explanation.
Michael, I posted your layouts in a few Model Train Groups and the guys are blown away. I hope you keep on building, the layout is coming along so nice. I think it could be one of the best European model train layouts in the USA. A few months ago we were commissioned to build a massive Marklin layout for a wealthy customer. The layout will be massive completely computer-controlled. The layout will be remarkable, we just started on the benchwork. We will be posting progress soon.
Rey, thanks a lot. It's nice that you like the layout, because I don't so much. I have a lot of trouble still with the German theme and with the catenary as well. If the layout survives it will be without catenary and I will be limited to steam and diesel. Because of all this I'm not making any progress and that does not make me happy.
I've had no interest in the layout for a month but today I started working again. I installed another occupancy detector module and started wiring it up.
I finished wiring the track of this peninsula to the block detection module. Trains are running while I'm posting this
!
Now the fun starts: making mountains!
I've installed some supports for the screen wire:
I've added the base for a dirt road across this "mountain" (more like an ant hill):
Here comes the screen wire:
I added a layer of plaster cloth. Not bad for a Sunday afternoon...
Michael:
Glad you got back into building!
Ulrich
I made a few modifications to my (mole) hill:
I spent 2 hours this morning with sculptamold and rock castings trying to make this thing look like something other than a mole hill but it just doesn't work. I'm not sure what I will do now.
How about lots of trees, interspersed with a few rocks? That would make for some credible foothills to larger mountains. I assume you still have trees left over from previous projects.
-- Ernest
Michael:
I decided to do what Ernest suggested. I do not model mountains, but the foothills of them. My motivatng areas for modelling are the Lahn valley and particularly the Eifel region in Germany. The mountains are lower and more rounded in these regions because they are much older than new ones like the Alps.
Ulrich